tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4271373189216022547.post2992405618749945055..comments2023-11-21T12:51:59.908-08:00Comments on Murderboarding Inc.: Wings of a Dove Haven S5E24 The Widening GyreAnna Hammetthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10095633218958433882noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4271373189216022547.post-75363664776240371452016-01-07T20:39:31.003-08:002016-01-07T20:39:31.003-08:00wait, did you... are you talking about the unexpla...wait, did you... are you talking about the unexplained potatoes? because yes, yes it is an x-files reference and I may have to love you forever for getting it. <br /> <br /><br />I tend to fill in their world with bits and pieces from Stephen King's Dark Tower series, but you're right, they are entrenched in speciesism and at that point, given that any glimpse we would have had of their world would probably have involved some humans coming back to it, actually, now that you mention it, that could get really interesting. My best guess, as far as dogs and doves and coffee, is that it's something more like parallel universes and parallel development, because especially if they're more technologically advanced than us, they've probably done more exploring that way. And we know science has already postulated and at least mathematically? I think, proven the existence of parallel universes! <br /><br />I was really, really shocked to find that I wanted more of William after his brief appearance in the void. That was weird. But yeah, it would be interesting to find out what the full range of people over there is like. And the final bits with Croatoan were... shaky? Scattered? It certainly couldn't have made it worse. <br /><br />Hey, if we're really lucky maybe someone will write a spinoff or a tiein novel or something! Kitty Chandlerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05524808952260453841noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4271373189216022547.post-29493555381030239862016-01-06T09:20:16.520-08:002016-01-06T09:20:16.520-08:00That's true, because even the "good"...That's true, because even the "good" people from their world only seemed to care when Mara and William's messes were going to affect them personally.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00374728225643443727noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4271373189216022547.post-64620375727254782512016-01-03T22:59:30.792-08:002016-01-03T22:59:30.792-08:00I always kind of thought maybe their world was lik...I always kind of thought maybe their world was like a...parallel to ours, just maybe a notch or two further down the evolutionary scale, or something like that? Which means it's certainly possible they do have dogs and all sorts of the same things we have, generally.<br />The superiority thing annoyed me, but honestly? As interesting as they are, I have a feeling no one on their side would give a fuck about whatever messes their people are causing here, just going by the general attitude of the people we've met, like Charlotte before she got stuck here and Croatoan. I'd figure they were content to toss Croatoan in the void and forget about him.PaintedWolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02143841248201859328noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4271373189216022547.post-51574545827132833772016-01-03T13:20:11.419-08:002016-01-03T13:20:11.419-08:00First thing I just have to get out of the way is -...First thing I just have to get out of the way is -- oh my god, is that an X-Files reference? <br /><br />Now as for the actual episode (and finale, at this point), I am forever going to be sad that we didn't learn more about Mara and William's world. Up until these last few episodes their world has seemed pretty different from our world. Their people are so advanced compared to the people in our world that they're entrenched in species-ism and are inclined to think of us as inferior, which I think everyone (except perhaps Howard?) from their world has displayed. And none of them seem to understand that CONSENT IS IMPORTANT, between Charlotte and Howard's rehabilitation/punishment for Mara (Howard at least, seems to lean toward the punishment and imprisonment aspect, versus Charlotte who believed in the overwriting-her-personality as rehabilitation), Croatoan's experimentation on both his daughter and the first Crocker, then Mara and William's experimentation on local humans. Up until now, they've been playing up these differences between our world and theirs, which makes it pretty jarring that they have dogs, doves (with the same symbolism), and coffee. The dogs part especially trips me up, because if there are no humans over there, how are there dogs? Did dogs originate from there? Or have a common ancestor? Either of those explanations means that at some point, travel between worlds was much more common than it is now and probably only ceased after Mara and William’s experiments commenced. <br /><br />I really hoped William would come back in the finale, having been back to his world and explained to their authorities about Croatoan’s presence. I wanted their authorities to come unite with the Haven citizens against Croatoan and force him back to their world for justice or something. We could’ve met more of their people and maybe gained more of an understanding of who they are. We’ve only met the people involved with Mara and William, which offers a limited perspective on what their people are like. By necessity of what they’ve seen and dealt with, they have a certain cynicism towards the two of them and toward the experiments they conducted. Maybe the rest of their people have a less black-and-white attitude toward criminal activity. I don’t know. We’ll probably never know. I hate not knowing; their world sounded so interesting. <br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00374728225643443727noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4271373189216022547.post-5311799074035205112015-12-26T00:32:00.391-08:002015-12-26T00:32:00.391-08:00Yeah, I sympathised enough with Nathan in that'...Yeah, I sympathised enough with Nathan in that's pretty much who he is, hell even I Wanted to Believe things would work out for about 2.5 seconds, but yeah a little more thought I guess would've helped.<br />I'm glad where Dwight ended up, yes, but I'll scream forever over DukePaintedWolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02143841248201859328noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4271373189216022547.post-32828547806690657862015-12-24T10:59:23.904-08:002015-12-24T10:59:23.904-08:00Okay, let's see if I can cram the whole reply ...Okay, let's see if I can cram the whole reply into one comment.<br /><br />YES, essentially, to the Duke stuff. Both the way Balfour played it (or the way he was directed to play it?) and the way it was scripted sounded like possession, but now we never got a concrete answer as to which it was, or both, or how much of each, or what was going on. Arguably yes! His anger and hurt and frustration and especially the struggle against the addictiveness of the Crocker Trouble totally could have opened him up to even partial possession but what am concrete evidence or outright saying anything. Argh. I like your programming theory though I'm not sure where even to cram it in in terms of the timeline. Or even a partial programming! I wonder what a partial programming would look like, would it be Lexi or something else.<br /><br />A hyperintelligent Duke... I'd be terrified. Given what he was doing already? And that at least half of that seemed to be succeeding because the rest of the main cast required shaking some sense into? Yeah, on second thought let us not have hyperintelligent evil Duke. As for downsides, I bet it would involve something like either your brain overheats and bakes in your skull or you lose all ability to communicate outside your head, at least if Eureka and Fringe (and, I think, Alphas?) are examples to go by. <br /><br />Augh Croatoan. I feel like this episode should have come with trigger warnings for abusive parents, this and the one where Charlotte overwrote her daughter. Mara's entire family, I just. I really wonder. Especially if we're supposed to see Howard as contrast, which is sort of fine, he seems like a decent parent at least within the confines of his current programming, but urk.<br /><br />Heh, speaking of brains overheating. I think Nathan might have suspected something if he hadn't been wanting so hard to be able to catch Duke, to be able to talk to him and turn him back around like nothing had happened. I don't think you missed any discussion on it other than NATHAN STOP BEING STUPID but possibly there should have been, I really think Nathan's stupid was at least in large part because that's what Nathan DOES when the people he loves are in danger or not themselves or in some other way taken from him, he gets stupid, he gets stubborn, and he ignores everything that doesn't fit with If I Do This I Can Get Them Back. Which is understandable on some levels but Oh Nathan.<br /><br />I am, however, as much as I want to throttle people for WHY DIDN'T DUKE GET HIS HAPPY ENDING THIS IS NTO A HAPPY ENDING, I am really happy with how Dwight ended up. Kitty Chandlerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05524808952260453841noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4271373189216022547.post-37550996101279668522015-12-14T02:16:46.866-08:002015-12-14T02:16:46.866-08:00I really kind of thought Nathan should have suspec...I really kind of thought Nathan should have suspected something when Duke walked in through the door exactly like they wanted him to. I mean, if he really wanted the Guard-bait could he not have just sneak-phased through a fucking wall, frozen everyone and grabbed the one(s) he wants and tipped the rest over because evil and possessed and high on Troubled blood? No? Or did I miss discussion on this? Also, no discussion on who Duke has killed and what fucking Troubles he has now? Are the four people he murdered not on the Trouble Census? Has no one checked? Can we please for the love of fuck know what else he’s capable of? And guys. Super strength is one of the side effects of his own Trouble, even if he doesn’t already have other Troubles he can use too. Chaining him up in un-phaseable chains only fucking works if he can’t get out of them some other way. Nathan. I know you are most likely severely compromised by trauma and oh, I don’t know both your girlfriend and boyfriend are kind of fucked right now, but really.<br /><br />And just for a little more for fuck’s sake, that ship metaphor when we happen to have a literal captain of a ship running around murdering people and with the odd theory floating around of him being the one to captain That Darn Barn?<br /><br />I was honestly thinking for a second that Dwight was going to go into that house and get violently killed because last season and going into a potential villain’s lair on your own Dwight? Except now I’m pretty sure this is going to turn out so much worse, because that’s been the trend of things lately. <br />Poor, poor Dwight. Poor Nathan. Poor Audrey. Poor Duke. Poor everyone. <br />Except Croatoan. Fuck him.PaintedWolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02143841248201859328noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4271373189216022547.post-24597594915279026552015-12-14T02:13:57.793-08:002015-12-14T02:13:57.793-08:00I really kind of thought Nathan should have suspec...I really kind of thought Nathan should have suspected something when Duke walked in through the door exactly like they wanted him to. I mean, if he really wanted the Guard-bait could he not have just sneak-phased through a fucking wall, frozen everyone and grabbed the one(s) he wants and tipped the rest over because evil and possessed and high on Troubled blood? No? Or did I miss discussion on this? Also, no discussion on who Duke has killed and what fucking Troubles he has now? Are the four people he murdered not on the Trouble Census? Has no one checked? Can we please for the love of fuck know what else he’s capable of? And guys. Super strength is one of the side effects of his own Trouble, even if he doesn’t already have other Troubles he can use too. Chaining him up in un-phaseable chains only fucking works if he can’t get out of them some other way. Nathan. I know you are most likely severely compromised by trauma and oh, I don’t know both your girlfriend and boyfriend are kind of fucked right now, but really.<br /><br />And just for a little more for fuck’s sake, that ship metaphor when we happen to have a literal captain of a ship running around murdering people and with the odd theory floating around of him being the one to captain That Darn Barn?<br /><br />I was honestly thinking for a second that Dwight was going to go into that house and get violently killed because last season and going into a potential villain’s lair on your own Dwight? Except now I’m pretty sure this is going to turn out so much worse, because that’s been the trend of things lately. <br />Poor, poor Dwight. Poor Nathan. Poor Audrey. Poor Duke. Poor everyone. <br />Except Croatoan. Fuck him.PaintedWolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02143841248201859328noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4271373189216022547.post-21260983622013544992015-12-14T02:12:09.417-08:002015-12-14T02:12:09.417-08:00Right, very long comment coming up. In parts, no l...Right, very long comment coming up. In parts, no less. Sorry.<br />I can’t figure out Duke either, and it’s driving me crazy! I want to go with possession for reasons (the same reason you mention. Though I could take pretty much anything other than well actually He’s Evil Now Because Deep Down He’s Always Been Evil), but after all that we planned everything all along fuckery, I don’t know. Because honestly, I feel like Duke is more than capable of fucking with people- especially Nathan- like that. Hell, even that whole maybe he mentioned Dave because he’s trying to give us info without Croatoan knowing sounds exactly like something our Duke would probably do if he could. And yes, whatever else is going on, the anger over being used to kill people was all Duke. Dammit.<br />Ah, thank you for mentioning the mannerisms and behaviour! I’d noticed that too, like Eric Balfour has made Duke a completely different person, and I was also thinking along the lines of maybe that does mean possible possession, but it had also occurred to me that maybe I’m just rationalizing where there is none to be had. But his body language doesn’t read at all like Duke’s, not to mention, the way he talks sounds, if not rehearsed, but very deliberate, almost to the point where it feels forced in some places.<br />Yeah, the programmed thing is interesting considering Howard, and Mara and all the rewriting her personality she’d been through, Vince’s bitching over arguing with an AI, and the amount of times since Hayley’s death that Duke has said the same variations on “this is who I am”, “this is my destiny” etc. etc. Maybe it isn’t so much possession as having rewritten/overridden his Operating System? Or you know, reinstalling the driver(a bug in the system maybe?) Oh my god, I’m going to stop now. <br />That last scene where Duke was all yes I can hear you bitches freaked me right out, Duke stoppit your evilness is messing with my general I heart you aura. <br />That page said hyperintelligence? Given the preview, that might not be what he goes for but no, guys, no. Super super smart Duke would appeal to my geekiness on any other day (then again because This is a Trouble, there’s almost certainly a downside to it which I will not contemplate) than when he’s being evil murderous Croatoan Trouble collector and just no.<br /><br />Croatoan just honestly reads like a handbook of abusive jackass when he’s not being his own brand of damaged as fuck and self-righteous and crazy and It. Gives. Me. The. Creeps. Poor Audrey’s going to have to make an appointment with her shower and some steel wool after this. I wanted to make an appointment with my shower and some steel wool.<br />Oh I was so too all over look Walter Bishop when he was telling Audrey his riveting tale about how he saved her life when she was a kid and now she’s his most bestest creation. Ugh. Stop being so creepy as fuck...<br />PaintedWolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02143841248201859328noreply@blogger.com